Is a sex-change a constitutional right?Follow

How convenient that he chose NOW to make these big decisions, huh?

I'm sure he put all sorts of thought into demanding it from the military prison system, yes.

Of course, I'm sure he didn't take committing espionage against the United States lightly either. This guy is just full of wonderful benefits for this nation that he doesn't take lightly.

Edited, Aug 25th 2013 1:40pm by Jophiel

The crime Manning was convicted of holds little bearing on the validity of a decision to request hormone therapy be provided.

Give the kid some Xanax.

I'm not. He's the one who committed the espionage. Oh, poor baby for wanting to be a girl; that certainly meant he needed to leak classified national security secrets to the world. Isn't that in the ole Super Modern Mental Health Guidebook as the prime symptom?

He committed a crime. A serious one. That means he pays consequences, one of which should be NOT receiving completely voluntary treatments that have zero bearing on his physical health duinr his incarceration. If he wants to talk to a shrink or whatever, fine since I'm assuming that's a treatment available for most prisoners.


Right. And so how did this course of action work out for him?

Edited, Aug 25th 2013 2:06pm by Jophiel

I didn't realize that handwaving away espionage so precious little snowflakes can get their voluntary hormone meds was a liberal position, but sure.

He wouldn't be discharged at all, he'd be barred from reenlistment, and would have still gotten either an honorable discharge or a medical discharge, neither of which means much of anything when looking for new employment.

That's my stance on this as well. If we were talking about James Holmes, I'd still set the same standard for medical treatment. Or if we were talking about PoWs, Guantanamo, etc.

Side note: I can't find any part of me that seriously wants to condemn manning for his actions. I feel like the situation he was placed in is one where it would conceivably have been considered treason either way, one with regards to the government, one with regards to the people the constitute the nation. The only crime I would have been willing to accept him as legitimately guilty is the charge he was cleared of.

But I don't think this thread needs to be about whether or not Manning is guilty. That ship has sailed. /shrug.



That's good to know. Definitely the better course of events. I'm not entirely sure what about GID makes it a disqualifying medical condition, but that's neither here nor there.



I doubt any of us are holding the position that Manning should get special treatment. I'm saying that I think he should get the hormone therapy treatment, yeah. I take it as a given that this means such treatment should be available in general. And if access to therapists isn't available now, it really, really should be.

But if we're talking about GID, specifically, it's particularly important. Considering treatment for GID as cosmetic is... extremely odd, to me. The statistics for suicide among people with GID is horrifying. Up to 3/4 of the population is suicidal, with 30-50% of them attempting suicide in their lifetime (really quick google searches - I only know the teen rates off the top of my head). Sure, these stresses are more linked to societal influence than the state itself. But I doubt that would simply stop being a factor in prison.

I really hope a sample size of 1 isn't sufficient evidence for the armed forces.

And we went back in for a second Iraq war, so I'm going to say it generally isn't.

Saying he should be given treatments not already authorized by the military prison system is 100% the definition of saying he should be getting special treatment.

If he was in prison for child molestation, I'd be saying that first he ****** children and now he wants the government to pay for his hormone therapy. You're correct in part for the crime not being especially relevant.

However, he picked espionage as his crime of choice while part of the armed forces which put him in a military prison which disqualifies him from getting the treatment he suddenly decided he really, really needs (upon, you know, having been sentenced). Good thing he didn't make that choice lightly.

Edited, Aug 25th 2013 4:15pm by Jophiel

They're not. You're asking for the rules to be changed using Manning as the catalyst. That's special treatment. Calling me Gbaji won't make that any less true.

That's fair. I think federal prisons shouldn't offer it so there ya go.

So women got special treatment when they received the right to vote. And the mentally disabled got special treatment when we founded mental care facilities, instead of just tossing them in prison. And the gays are getting special treatment by asking for marriage. And Rosa Parks got special treatment when Blacks had more of their civil rights recognized.