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#102 Dec 22 2011 at 5:30 PM Rating: Decent
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I'd end varus if you made it easy for me, sure. I'd kind of liked to have put a bullet in him just as he typed the words, "I'm always on my guard."

I've never killed anyone, but I totally would. Just give me a reason. I don't need to dehumanize them. I'm more a utilitarian. It's not something I expressly like about myself, but I'd probably enjoy it, and I don't have any categorical prohibitions against it. Not that I like hurting people that don't deserve it... I don't even like swinging hard in practice vs. others. But give me a valid reason why killing someone would be better for the world, and the only reason I'd hesitate would be to savor it.

Fortunately for people like varus, there are behavioral determinants like knowable legal consequences, as well as axiological problems, like the unknowability of ultimate consequences, to keep him safe.
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#103 Dec 22 2011 at 7:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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Kachi wrote:
I'd end varus if you made it easy for me, sure. I'd kind of liked to have put a bullet in him just as he typed the words, "I'm always on my guard."

I've never killed anyone, but I totally would. Just give me a reason. I don't need to dehumanize them. I'm more a utilitarian. It's not something I expressly like about myself, but I'd probably enjoy it, and I don't have any categorical prohibitions against it. Not that I like hurting people that don't deserve it... I don't even like swinging hard in practice vs. others. But give me a valid reason why killing someone would be better for the world, and the only reason I'd hesitate would be to savor it.

Fortunately for people like varus, there are behavioral determinants like knowable legal consequences, as well as axiological problems, like the unknowability of ultimate consequences, to keep him safe.


Coming over the hill, Kachi sees it. It's a massive complex, with all the practical sterility of a military base. An overscaled satellite dish sits atop a large, windowless building, standing taller than the myriad other structures ringing it. Heavily armed soldiers in white are everywhere, patrolling catwalks and guarding doorways.

Kachi takes another look at the wombat pelt that Kao provided him. Scrawled on it in sloppy text are two numbers. "69.1938,-145.129395". He utters a silent curse for the handwriting of programmers. But this has to be the place. The middle of nowhere, Alaska. He is tired and hungry, but his goal must be close.

After some careful searching, he comes upon a fenced shed on the exterior of the complex. Kachi climbs a nearby tree and leaps over. After a brief pause to make sure that he wasn't detected, he slips through the door. Finding a ventilation shaft, he crawls inside.

He navigates the labyrinthine passageway, doubling back numerous times at dead ends and wrong turns. He's not quite sure what he's looking for, but something tells him that "He" is close. A sixth sense seems to be taking him in deeper into the complex...he must be getting close to that central building.

Abruptly, the path ends at a massive vertical duct. High above him, Kachi can see the louvers of an exterior vent. Hot air pushes past him to it from the darkness below. He takes a deep breath, affixes his grappling hook to the edge, and rappels down into the abyss.

Finding the ground, he detaches himself. It's pitch black. He strikes a flare, but it does little to abate the darkness that surrounds him. Then suddenly, there's a deafening "CLACK" as dozens of high-intensity bulbs turn on, blinding him. Kachi raises a hand to shield his eyes as they adjust.

Around him, all manner of electronic devices hum and whir. Cables from them draw the eye towards the center of the room, where a giant white cube sits. A single door occupies the wall of the cube facing Kachi. The words on it are unmistakable.

"VARUS"

Soundlessly, Kachi stalks towards the door. He draws the nunchucks from his utility belt, wishing he'd picked a more practical weapon. He turns the knob, opens the door, and steps inside, readying himself.

Inside, Kachi pauses, confused. There's nobody inside. Just a giant tower of computers. All of the wires that had led to the room are plugged into its side.

"WHAT ARE YOU DOING, KACHI." The voice, which seems to come from everywhere and nowhere at once, startles him. He whirls around, swinging the nunchucks awkwardly, but there's nobody to be seen. Then he sees the monitors on the walls. On them are the words he heard, and a blinking command line prompt. It's only then that the realization dawns on him.

"I'm here to kill you, Varus." he says.

"HAH. UNLIKELY." intones the voice. "I'M ALWAYS ON GUARD. I'VE BEEN FIGHTING BLACKS AND MEXICANS ON THE STREETS SINCE I WAS A KID."

What to do? Somehow, Kachi suspsects that nunchucking the computer isn't going to accomplish anything. He recalls that in the movies, evil AI's can be destroyed by posing them a logical paradox.

"Hey varus, what do you think about Herman Cain?" he asks.

"HERMAN CAIN IS GREAT. DEMOCRATS ONLY HATE HIM BECAUSE HE'S A SUCCESSFUL BUSINESSMAN. THOSE ******* THAT ACCUSE HIM ARE TOTAL WHORES." comes the reply.

"And what do you think of blacks?"

"THEY'RE ALL LAZY GOOD-FOR-NOTHING N*******."

"But Cain is black, Varus. How can you like him, if you hate him?" Kachi says calmly.

Chaos ensues. The computer tower begins to spark and smoke. All around him Kachi can hear an electrical hiss, and the floor begins to give a dull rumble. The voice is stuttering now:

"BUT...I...HATE...DEMOCRATS....COMMIES....CAIN...HATE....BUSINESS...CHESS....I....*****************

Kachi heads for the door. "So long, Varus." he mutters, as it closes behind him.

"THIS IS IMPOSSIBLE." the voice booms behind him. "CHICKS LOVE ME. I ONCE SCORED 42 POINTS AGAINST BELMONT." The sparks and smoke have given way to full blown explosions, now. The voice gets more frantic, more confused, as it slowly fizzles out.

"YOU CAN'T DO THIS. I DRIVE A NISSAN ALTIMA. I DRIVE A NISSON ALTIM..."

...is the last thing Kachi hears, as he climbs back out through the ducts. He wonders what the other posters found when they went in search of Gbaji, ThiefX, and Almalieque. They should be nearing their targets, as well.

For a few weeks, it's as if nothing has changed. Then slowly, the ZAM forums adjust to the absences. The Asylum becomes a forum for discussing soup recipes and the pros and cons of the Kaldor-Hicks model of economic efficiency.

The End.


Edited, Dec 22nd 2011 6:48pm by Kaolian

Edited, Dec 23rd 2011 12:10am by Eske

Edited, Dec 23rd 2011 1:29am by Eske
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#104 Dec 22 2011 at 7:43 PM Rating: Good
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Smashing the monitors can also destroy highly advanced computer systems.

The More You Know...
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#105 Dec 22 2011 at 7:57 PM Rating: Excellent
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Debalic wrote:
Smashing the monitors can also destroy highly advanced computer systems.

The More You Know...


Yup. Equilibrium taught me that one.

Edited, Dec 22nd 2011 8:58pm by Eske
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#106 Dec 22 2011 at 8:25 PM Rating: Excellent
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Debalic wrote:
Smashing the monitors can also destroy highly advanced computer systems.

The More You Know...



As can pouring coffee on the keyboard. I thought everyone knew this.

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#107 Dec 22 2011 at 8:28 PM Rating: Good
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Eske Esquire wrote:
Debalic wrote:
Smashing the monitors can also destroy highly advanced computer systems.

The More You Know...


Yup. Equilibrium taught me that one.

Yeah, that was the first thing I thought of!
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publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
#108 Dec 22 2011 at 8:39 PM Rating: Good
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Eske Esquire wrote:
a lot of awesome

......I want to know who went after the others.... and what they found.... was it the hideous canadian bigfoot who was sent after Alma? Did Jophiel and gbaji square off in an epic duel to the death? Which poorbrave soul did Kao send after ThiefX? I GOTS TO KNOW!

I HATE CLIFFHANGERS, GOD DAMMIT
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Glitterhands wrote:
Am I the only one who clicked on this thread expecting actual baby photos [of Jinte]? o.O

Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#109 Dec 22 2011 at 10:17 PM Rating: Good
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I was tasked to assassinate ThiefX, but then...I got high and just sort of, wandered off...
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publiusvarus wrote:
we all know liberals are well adjusted american citizens who only want what's best for society. While conservatives are evil money grubbing scum who only want to sh*t on the little man and rob the world of its resources.
#110 Dec 23 2011 at 8:40 AM Rating: Good
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How could you tell the difference, anyway?
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#111 Dec 23 2011 at 9:26 AM Rating: Excellent
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Lady Jinte wrote:
Eske Esquire wrote:
a lot of awesome

......I want to know who went after the others.... and what they found.... was it the hideous canadian bigfoot who was sent after Alma? Did Jophiel and gbaji square off in an epic duel to the death? Which poorbrave soul did Kao send after ThiefX? I GOTS TO KNOW!

I HATE CLIFFHANGERS, GOD DAMMIT

I'll be honest, I feel like the story should have ended with Jophiel coming out from behind the computers and saying, "Well, time to make another account. Trollololol."



Admit edit: As far as I know, Jophiel is not actually Varus's ghost writer. As. Far. As. I. Know.

Edited, Dec 23rd 2011 10:27am by LockeColeMA
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#112 Dec 23 2011 at 12:14 PM Rating: Excellent
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LockeColeMA wrote:
I'll be honest, I feel like the story should have...


Smiley: bah

Stay tuned for the gripping sequel:

Fatal Spin: The Gbaji Protocol

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#113 Dec 23 2011 at 3:25 PM Rating: Good
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I'm soooo glad I popped back in this thread.
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#114 Dec 23 2011 at 3:35 PM Rating: Good
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Really need something beyond Excellent and it extend to the Admins too. Really best laugh I had all day.

ADD strikes again

Edited, Dec 23rd 2011 4:37pm by RavennofTitan
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#115 Dec 23 2011 at 4:28 PM Rating: Good
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LockeColeMA wrote:
Lady Jinte wrote:
Eske Esquire wrote:
a lot of awesome

......I want to know who went after the others.... and what they found.... was it the hideous canadian bigfoot who was sent after Alma? Did Jophiel and gbaji square off in an epic duel to the death? Which poorbrave soul did Kao send after ThiefX? I GOTS TO KNOW!

I HATE CLIFFHANGERS, GOD DAMMIT

I'll be honest, I feel like the story should have ended with Jophiel coming out from behind the computers and saying, "Well, time to make another account. Trollololol."



Admit edit: As far as I know, Jophiel is not actually Varus's ghost writer. As. Far. As. I. Know.

Edited, Dec 23rd 2011 10:27am by LockeColeMA


I don't think it would be possible for Joph to write anyone that stupid. He could try, but it still wouldn't be quite there.
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#116 Dec 23 2011 at 8:08 PM Rating: Good
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Thankyou Eske.

I realised I had to put a caveat on my equilibrium on the thought of killing someone if I had to. I'm short and weak. The first thing my self defence instructor said was: Immediately fight incredibly dirty and then run away as fast as you can". Since in this hypothetical I'm hanging around to kill someone after I've either ripped their nostrils open or poked their eyes in, I might have to finish off by curb-stomping their face and brainpan. That would probably make me throw up at the time, and give me the "icks" for a long time afterwards. But I still would do it if I felt it was a morally justified kill.
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#117 Dec 25 2011 at 11:58 PM Rating: Good
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Eske Esquire wrote:
LockeColeMA wrote:
I'll be honest, I feel like the story should have...


Smiley: bah

Stay tuned for the gripping sequel:

Fatal Spin: The Gbaji Protocol

"Don't retreat, reload...FOR ADVENTURE."


DO WANT


Also, since I never actually replied to the initial topic:

I feel I could probably kill someone, if either I didn't know them personally, or I really didn't like them. I doubt it would affect me emotionally that much, since I'm a fairly apathetic person in regards to pretty much everything, but at the same time, my apathy is also whatwould also probably stop me from actually killing them.
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Glitterhands wrote:
Am I the only one who clicked on this thread expecting actual baby photos [of Jinte]? o.O

Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#118 Dec 26 2011 at 8:24 PM Rating: Decent
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Smiley: laughThat just made my year.
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Hyrist wrote:
Ok, now we're going to get slash fiction of Wint x Kachi somehere... rule 34 and all...

Never confuse your inference as the listener for an implication of the speaker.

Good games are subjective like good food is subjective. You're not going to seriously tell me that there's not a psychological basis for why pizza is great and lutefisk is revolting. The thing about subjectivity is that, as subjects go, humans actually have a great deal in common.
#119 Dec 27 2011 at 11:12 AM Rating: Good
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I was thinking about this recently, actually. I don't think it's a systematic hatred created by political necessity as much as it is human nature. At least, the murderous part of our human nature manifests itself in that way. Before modern civilization, the tribe living closest to yours was potentially dangerous, scary, different, and largely unknown. As humans we have a very insular, tribal community necessity to feel protected. Killing another human wasn't the taboo we have now in our modern society. The problem is, our natural inclinations are filtered through all of the trappings of modern religion, political correctness, and modern weaponry. People who have the innate drive to murder (which isn't everyone; but warriors exist) now have to formulate elaborate reasons to justify their actions.

We have a contradictory nature. We require support in groups, but we need OUR group to be safe and protected from anyone different or dangerous. There are people who take that to extremes. It is human nature to kill, but not all humans have the desire in them. I would never commit murder. Is it "okay" to murder in some circumstances? Sure. I never have and never will. I've got more of a live and let live mentality. I cringe watching animals become part of the food chain.
#120 Dec 27 2011 at 7:18 PM Rating: Excellent
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Guenny! I was thinking about you all today. You and BT still hanging out?

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#121 Dec 27 2011 at 9:08 PM Rating: Excellent
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Samira wrote:
Guenny! I was thinking about you all today. You and BT still hanging out?


We will have been married two years here in February. It's been the most magical time of my life, even better than the year I served as David Copperfield's eyebrow manicurist.

Okay, that's a lie.

Guenny's at work and I found my way to this little corner of the internet where I'm not allowed. Hello friends, I'm well. I miss you, Allakhazoo. I formally apologize and if ever unbanned I promise to never be bad, like ever.


And as to the original question: Yes, I could kill someone. In fact, I've been working on delaying my ****** just in case. Bye now. Please don't ban my wife.
#122 Dec 28 2011 at 2:21 PM Rating: Good
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When the heck did BT get banned? Was I gone that long from the forums?

/wave BT
#123 Dec 28 2011 at 2:50 PM Rating: Good
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Thumbelyna Quick Hands wrote:
When the heck did BT get banned? Was I gone that long from the forums?

/wave BT

glad I'm not the only one who didn't know BT got banned Smiley: lol
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Glitterhands wrote:
Am I the only one who clicked on this thread expecting actual baby photos [of Jinte]? o.O

Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#124 Dec 28 2011 at 3:13 PM Rating: Good
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BT got banned for suggesting flat out saying that gbaji was a rapist. At least, that's the proverbial straw.

But if they allow Varus back over and over after his repeated misogyny, use of The N-Word, and wishes of death on liberals then I'm not sure why BT hasn't been allowed back. Varus has been far more hateful than BT ever was, mostly because Varus either does or pretends to actually believe the horrible comments he makes.

And to any administrators reading this, yes, I believe that calling ALL WOMEN sluts and whores is infinitely more hateful than calling one poster a rapist in jest.

#125 Dec 28 2011 at 3:27 PM Rating: Good
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I found the thread that got BT banned. My oh my, I was rather entertained. How did I miss that thread?
#126 Dec 28 2011 at 3:27 PM Rating: Good
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This thread, mostly. Though if I remember right, he also said some stuff to/about Kao?
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#127 Dec 28 2011 at 3:38 PM Rating: Good
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I got the sense that it was more of what BT directed at Kao was the final straw. I understand where Kao's position is. Kao's actions were part of employment duties. Due to the intertwining of social media sites, what used to thought of as anonymous posting now can be traced rather easily. And even if accusing someone in jest can be actionable. It would be up to the trier of fact in a lawsuit to decide whether that jest caused damages or not.
#128 Dec 28 2011 at 4:13 PM Rating: Good
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Thumbelyna Quick Hands wrote:
I got the sense that it was more of what BT directed at Kao was the final straw. I understand where Kao's position is. Kao's actions were part of employment duties. Due to the intertwining of social media sites, what used to thought of as anonymous posting now can be traced rather easily. And even if accusing someone in jest can be actionable. It would be up to the trier of fact in a lawsuit to decide whether that jest caused damages or not.


Then I say, again, that every Varus post should be locked as evidence in a potential lawsuit.
#129 Dec 28 2011 at 6:08 PM Rating: Excellent
I'm pretty sure varrus is banned at the moment.
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#130 Dec 28 2011 at 7:27 PM Rating: Excellent
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Sir Xsarus wrote:
I'm pretty sure varrus is banned at the moment.


Huh. I thought it was a mute.

Interesting.
#131 Dec 28 2011 at 7:46 PM Rating: Good
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Belkira wrote:
Sir Xsarus wrote:
I'm pretty sure varrus is banned at the moment.


Huh. I thought it was a mute.

Interesting.
"Bans" are usually indefinite mutes, IIRC. Actual bans where they delete the user and the content s/he has posted are pretty rare.
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#132 Dec 28 2011 at 9:25 PM Rating: Excellent
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The difference between BT and varus is that varus is blindingly obvious in the falseness of his posts, whereas BT was deceptively good enough to make what he posted sound like a real opinion.
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#133 Dec 28 2011 at 9:29 PM Rating: Excellent
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Sure, but that's like saying BT was punished for being smart. Smarter than Varus, which is admittedly a low, low bar.

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#134 Dec 28 2011 at 9:31 PM Rating: Excellent
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lolgaxe wrote:
The difference between BT and varus is that varus is blindingly obvious in the falseness of his posts, whereas BT was deceptively good enough to make what he posted sound like a real opinion.
Well, varus is smart enough to not go after an admin with his personal attacks, as far as I've seen. Not that BT isn't smart enough to not do that, he likely just didn't give a ****.
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#135 Dec 28 2011 at 10:16 PM Rating: Excellent
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Belkira wrote:
Sir Xsarus wrote:
I'm pretty sure varrus is banned at the moment.


Huh. I thought it was a mute.

Interesting.
"Bans" are usually indefinite mutes, IIRC. Actual bans where they delete the user and the content s/he has posted are pretty rare.
Generally posters with any kind of significant post count don't actually get banned because with a ban comes a removal, at least as far as users are concerned, of all their posts. that creates weird holes in threads.

Typically users are just muted, and if it's a permanent no turning back kind of situation, their password and email are changed, because I believe muted posters can still use pm's.
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#136 Dec 28 2011 at 11:28 PM Rating: Good
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So, Xsarus, I think the real question is when should BT be allowed back?
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#137 Dec 28 2011 at 11:50 PM Rating: Good
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Timelordwho wrote:
So, Xsarus, I think the real question is when should BT be allowed back?

Frankly, this.
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#138 Dec 28 2011 at 11:54 PM Rating: Decent
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The real question is, does BT even care to come back? His posting rate seriously dropped off before he got banned anyway.
#139 Dec 29 2011 at 8:14 AM Rating: Good
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Samira wrote:
Sure, but that's like saying BT was punished for being smart.
Happens all the time.
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#140 Dec 29 2011 at 8:32 AM Rating: Good
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Belkira wrote:
BT got banned for suggesting flat out saying that gbaji was a rapist. At least, that's the proverbial straw.

But if they allow Varus back over and over after his repeated misogyny, use of The N-Word, and wishes of death on liberals then I'm not sure why BT hasn't been allowed back. Varus has been far more hateful than BT ever was, mostly because Varus either does or pretends to actually believe the horrible comments he makes.

And to any administrators reading this, yes, I believe that calling ALL WOMEN sluts and whores is infinitely more hateful than calling one poster a rapist in jest.



Timelordwho wrote:
So, Xsarus, I think the real question is when should BT be allowed back?
Varus keeps making new accounts to get around his bans/mutes. BT may very well be allowed to do so by now himself, if he ever cared to.
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#141 Dec 29 2011 at 8:42 AM Rating: Good
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Belkira wrote:


And to any administrators reading this, yes, I believe that calling ALL WOMEN sluts and whores is infinitely more hateful than calling one poster a rapist in jest.

Only liberal women are sluts and whores. Change your voter registration to (R) and your virginity will be restored to you - in tact.
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#142 Dec 29 2011 at 8:52 AM Rating: Excellent
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Uglysasquatch wrote:
Timelordwho wrote:
So, Xsarus, I think the real question is when should BT be allowed back?
Varus keeps making new accounts to get around his bans/mutes. BT may very well be allowed to do so by now himself, if he ever cared to.


Yeah, but he's respected their ban, so I think they should reward good behavior, rather than reward going around the system.
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#143 Dec 29 2011 at 9:08 AM Rating: Excellent
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I don't know how I quoted both of you...
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#144 Dec 29 2011 at 9:19 AM Rating: Excellent
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Forum moderation is a balancing act. I try not to ban a user just because they annoy me. We tend to give lots and lots of chances. But when someone has managed to **** off all the Admins and starts pushing the boundaries just to see where they are for their own amusement repeatedly, disrupting the forum repeatedly, despite near constant warnings and goes out of their way to antagonize me, well, there isn't a whole lot of reason to keep them around or ever allow them back frankly. They don't learn from the experiance, and I just end up banning them again later. Some people you can give second chances to, others it just doesn't work and it isn't even worth the effort to attempt it. Varus was an idiot, but he gave people something to karma camp constantly where the admins were basically ignoring it. I suppose there is thiefX for that now.

Barkingturtle will not be returning. Technically under the terms of the ban, I would also now be banning Guenny's account too since she was specifically instructed not to let him use that account. I'll limit that to a warning for now.

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#145 Dec 29 2011 at 10:05 AM Rating: Good
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Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
Forum moderation is a balancing act. I try not to ban a user just because they annoy me. We tend to give lots and lots of chances. But when someone has managed to **** off all the Admins and starts pushing the boundaries just to see where they are for their own amusement repeatedly, disrupting the forum repeatedly, despite near constant warnings and goes out of their way to antagonize me, well, there isn't a whole lot of reason to keep them around or ever allow them back frankly. They don't learn from the experiance, and I just end up banning them again later. Some people you can give second chances to, others it just doesn't work and it isn't even worth the effort to attempt it. Varus was an idiot, but he gave people something to karma camp constantly where the admins were basically ignoring it. I suppose there is thiefX for that now.

Barkingturtle will not be returning. Technically under the terms of the ban, I would also now be banning Guenny's account too since she was specifically instructed not to let him use that account. I'll limit that to a warning for now.

Administrator Kaolian


So what was his ban actually for--calling gbaji a rapist or angering the admins?
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#146 Dec 29 2011 at 10:48 AM Rating: Good
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idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
Forum moderation is a balancing act. I try not to ban a user just because they annoy me. We tend to give lots and lots of chances. But when someone has managed to **** off all the Admins and starts pushing the boundaries just to see where they are for their own amusement repeatedly, disrupting the forum repeatedly, despite near constant warnings and goes out of their way to antagonize me, well, there isn't a whole lot of reason to keep them around or ever allow them back frankly. They don't learn from the experiance, and I just end up banning them again later. Some people you can give second chances to, others it just doesn't work and it isn't even worth the effort to attempt it. Varus was an idiot, but he gave people something to karma camp constantly where the admins were basically ignoring it. I suppose there is thiefX for that now.

Barkingturtle will not be returning. Technically under the terms of the ban, I would also now be banning Guenny's account too since she was specifically instructed not to let him use that account. I'll limit that to a warning for now.

Administrator Kaolian


So what was his ban actually for--calling gbaji a rapist or angering the admins?
Obviously it was a culmination of those things.
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#147 Dec 29 2011 at 10:56 AM Rating: Good
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Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
Forum moderation is a balancing act. I try not to ban a user just because they annoy me. We tend to give lots and lots of chances. But when someone has managed to **** off all the Admins and starts pushing the boundaries just to see where they are for their own amusement repeatedly, disrupting the forum repeatedly, despite near constant warnings and goes out of their way to antagonize me, well, there isn't a whole lot of reason to keep them around or ever allow them back frankly. They don't learn from the experiance, and I just end up banning them again later. Some people you can give second chances to, others it just doesn't work and it isn't even worth the effort to attempt it. Varus was an idiot, but he gave people something to karma camp constantly where the admins were basically ignoring it. I suppose there is thiefX for that now.

Barkingturtle will not be returning. Technically under the terms of the ban, I would also now be banning Guenny's account too since she was specifically instructed not to let him use that account. I'll limit that to a warning for now.

Administrator Kaolian


So you don't think that Barkingturtle brings a better level of discussion than Varus?
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#148 Dec 29 2011 at 11:06 AM Rating: Excellent
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Timelordwho wrote:
So you don't think that Barkingturtle brings a better level of discussion than Varus?


Calling it discussion is awful generous of you... Smiley: wink
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#149 Dec 29 2011 at 11:16 AM Rating: Excellent
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idiggory, King of Bards wrote:
So what was his ban actually for--calling gbaji a rapist or angering the admins?


The ban itself was issued because an Administrator said "Do this and you will be banned" and he did that thing on top of all the other historical things that warnings had been issued for. The reason he probably won't ever be unbanned is a combination of all those historical warnings and the fact that he ****** all the other admins off as well.

Timelordwho wrote:

So you don't think that Barkingturtle brings a better level of discussion than Varus?


I really don't care to be honest. Varus tended to have slightly less objectionable content overall, which is really not saying that his content was not objectionable, but more a commentary on how bad some of the other stuff from Barkingturtle was. With varus gone now, unless others step into that niche more, there will be fewer response posts in asylum and people who came there to watch him get yelled at won't as much. Maybe he was keeping others away, so it will balance out? I don't know. From experiance I suspect we'll see a slight drop in posts in there overall, but sometimes you just have to cull the stupid.
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#150 Dec 29 2011 at 11:19 AM Rating: Good
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Timelordwho wrote:
Dread Lörd Kaolian wrote:
Forum moderation is a balancing act. I try not to ban a user just because they annoy me. We tend to give lots and lots of chances. But when someone has managed to **** off all the Admins and starts pushing the boundaries just to see where they are for their own amusement repeatedly, disrupting the forum repeatedly, despite near constant warnings and goes out of their way to antagonize me, well, there isn't a whole lot of reason to keep them around or ever allow them back frankly. They don't learn from the experiance, and I just end up banning them again later. Some people you can give second chances to, others it just doesn't work and it isn't even worth the effort to attempt it. Varus was an idiot, but he gave people something to karma camp constantly where the admins were basically ignoring it. I suppose there is thiefX for that now.

Barkingturtle will not be returning. Technically under the terms of the ban, I would also now be banning Guenny's account too since she was specifically instructed not to let him use that account. I'll limit that to a warning for now.

Administrator Kaolian


So you don't think that Barkingturtle brings a better level of discussion than Varus?
I can see both sides of it. On the one hand, BT continuously poked and prodded at the rules and at the admins on here, and if you don't eventually deal with something like that, nobody is going to respect the rules or admins. On the other hand, the Asylum's "anything goes" feel had been sacrosanct for so long that I'm not sure I would have a problem with the things he said as long as it was confined to the one portion of the site. I'm sure that with all the changes to making ZAM more ... friendly, even the Asylum rules are a bit more strict now than in the past.

But hey, that's just me.

Edited, Dec 29th 2011 12:21pm by Spoonless
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#151 Dec 29 2011 at 11:29 AM Rating: Decent
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So you don't think that Barkingturtle brings a better level of discussion than Varus?


This. Bring Back BT!!!
and for the record; I tend to view Varus like I would Dwight Schrute.. but yeah; saying words that obviously are there just to get a simply rise is just foolish..

As for killing people..
I read the book Generation Kill which seems to go nicely into the notion of desensitization of taking lives. Granted he was writing about US Marines and not your everyday person.. but I recall in one section, when he asked one 19 year old Marine how it felt after he got his first kill how it felt he said something like "It was just like Grand Theft Auto".
There surely is a vast difference between those that have been put in the situation to kill others now and those in times past.. such as WW2 or even the US Civil War...
When you read letters and memoirs from people in those wars you either find that people really suppress their emotions in different ways.. So I guess it is just a matter how compartmentalization. Even in the 1800s you read about people expressing the horror of what they have witnessed..
In WW2 it seems to have been a bit different.. as I think that for a man to show his emotions was a huge taboo and so as a result no one really talked about their experiences as much which lead to a lot of misconceptions about war after that.. in which future generations didn't really think much (to a degree) about how horrible killing is.. I think it was somewhat similar to Vietnam vets.. They were trapped in a time between trying to emulate the stoic bravery that they saw in their fathers' generation while at the same time coming to grips with the horrible reality of the situation..

Fast forward to todays generation of warrior and I think you will find things to be somewhat different (to a degree). Due to media and collective memory their views seem to take into account the emotional states of past generations.. because I think in those collective memories we have more of an opportunity to more fully explore the reflection of veterans from wars past in books, memoirs, and movies.. Do these things provide a full view of the realities of killing and combat? Not at all but they still allow for more emotional padding that I feel was not so available to warriors in past generations.
That being said; I still do not think that one can pad themselves enough to deal with killing another person. While I have certainly heard about people feeling absolutely nothing after taking another life for whatever reason; name of duty, self-defense, et al; I could not be convinced that the memories of these events would not act as planted seeds that cannot grow and bud later in life.. no matter how many video games and war movies that people have seen.

As far as myself.. I think that in the moment of need that I would be able to do it; though I pray that I will never be tested on this.
I know that there were times in school and childhood where I have sort of just snapped (with reason, such as someone consistently messing with me) and have attacked people regardless of their size or stature. It seems like the more thought that you can actually put into it; the harder that it would become. However, there is something to be said about being guided by your principles.. it is not easy but if you know where you stand and where your enemy stands then I think that it does not take much to just from one side of the fence to the other.. that is from pondering what the right thing to do it and to simply making the decision to kill..
If someone invaded my home; I would like to think that I would have enough discernment to be able to not simply shoot first but to actually be able to properly contemplate the situation and determine if any steps in-between are possible such as holding them at bay without pulling the trigger..
I know people who claim that they would LOVE to have someone break into their house just so they have the chance to shoot someone.. I do not share this sentiment but I understand it.. I don't think that it is out of the pure want to murder (in most cases) but more out of wanting to have a chance to test themselves emotionally and to add to their experience.
I would ask those people what they think they are testing themselves for.


TL;DR= In a combat situation or if my home/family were being attacked I would not hesitate to start pulling the trigger; but I hope I never have to find out..
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