Forum Settings
       
Reply To Thread

Putters and Journalistic EthicsFollow

#1 Jan 21 2014 at 12:16 AM Rating: Good
Official Shrubbery Waterer
*****
14,659 posts
Earlier this week, this article went up on Grantland about a fancy new putter. Upon trying the putter and talking with its inventor, the author concluded that it's unclear if the putter is actually any good, and that the inventor had completely fabricated her credentials (descendant of Commodore Cornelius Vanderbilt, graduate degree in aeronautical physics from MIT, worked on the B-2 stealth bomber, etc.).

Also, the inventor was a transgender in "deep stealth" who committed suicide a few months ago. It's unclear, but explicitly or implicitly implied by several other people around the Web, whether or not the investigation that led up to the article, and the fear of being outed upon its publication, drove her to commit suicide. She apparently had attempted suicide once before, and there is an extremely high rate of suicide in the transgender community compared to the general public.

There was some mixed reaction to the original article, then a strong surge of backlash, which culminated in two official response pieces from the site: one independent editorial on the mistakes made in the original article written by a transgender writer for ESPN (which also owns Grantland), and a letter from the editor-in-chief of the site addressing the breakdown in the editorial process.

It's all worth reading, if you have the time.

Edited, Jan 21st 2014 12:19am by Demea
____________________________
Jophiel wrote:
I managed to be both retarded and entertaining.

#2 Jan 21 2014 at 3:07 AM Rating: Good
*******
50,767 posts
I suck at putting, being transgender doesn't really make a putter better or worse, and suicide drops my level of caring to nonexistent. I think that about covers everything.
____________________________
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#3 Jan 21 2014 at 6:54 AM Rating: Decent
Skelly Poker Since 2008
*****
16,781 posts
lolgaxe wrote:
..being transgender doesn't really make a putter better or worse.
But which locker room should it use?

If we knew nothing about Dr. V sexual identity or preferences, would the investigative piece into the credibility of her putter have been questioned in regards to ethics?
____________________________
Alma wrote:
I lost my post
#4 Jan 21 2014 at 7:31 AM Rating: Decent
Lunatic
******
30,086 posts
It's all worth reading, if you have the time.

No it isn't. It's all smug self satisfied ************ celebrations of how enlightened Grantland readers are from the first article onward. Like most things written there, it's complete ********* and now someone's dead. Not their fault, obviously, but the idea that the linkbait hook the whole time wasn't the transgendered part is so insanely self serving and ludicrous it makes one want to vomit.
____________________________
Disclaimer:

To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#5 Jan 21 2014 at 8:07 AM Rating: Good
*******
50,767 posts
Elinda wrote:
But which locker room should it use?
I've never really been in a position where a club needed the use of a locker room, putter or otherwise.
____________________________
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#6 Jan 21 2014 at 8:16 AM Rating: Good
Skelly Poker Since 2008
*****
16,781 posts
lolgaxe wrote:
Elinda wrote:
But which locker room should it use?
I've never really been in a position where a club needed the use of a locker room, putter or otherwise.

But you can't just leave them outside the door - unattended.
____________________________
Alma wrote:
I lost my post
#7 Jan 21 2014 at 10:30 AM Rating: Excellent
Meat Popsicle
*****
13,666 posts
That was just weird, I'm not sure I have much else to add; except maybe that people spend entirely too much money on golf clubs.
____________________________
That monster in the mirror, he just might be you. -Grover
#8 Jan 21 2014 at 11:10 AM Rating: Excellent
Will swallow your soul
******
29,360 posts
From the Grantland editorial piece:

Quote:
Caleb’s biggest mistake? Outing Dr. V to one of her investors while she was still alive. I don’t think he understood the moral consequences of that decision, and frankly, neither did anyone working for Grantland. That misstep never occurred to me until I discussed it with Christina Kahrl yesterday. But that speaks to our collective ignorance about the issues facing the transgender community in general, as well as our biggest mistake: not educating ourselves on that front before seriously considering whether to run the piece.


Well, yeah, dumbass.

Now, it sounds like this particular person was a bit unstable anyway, and maybe being outed was not what pushed her to suicide. I have no idea; but it couldn't have helped.

I base my opinion about her instability on the putter design, by the way.
____________________________
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

#9 Jan 21 2014 at 11:58 AM Rating: Good
Skelly Poker Since 2008
*****
16,781 posts
Elinda wrote:

If we knew nothing about Dr. V sexual identity or preferences, would the investigative piece into the credibility of her putter have been questioned in regards to ethics?
I'm quoting myself, as I can better answer myself now that I've read the article(s) more fully.

The journalist Hannan was incredibly thoughtless in his pursuit of the truth. He needn't have published anything about Dr. V's credentials to review the club. He could merely have left them out of claim that they were unverifiable. It seems that the breaking straw for Dr. V was the email sent by Hannan claiming he'd learned the truth about her past.

If that one correspondence had been done with more tact and perhaps reassurances about what would get published or what would be kept secret etc etc. It might have staved off this particular suicide attempt - who knows.

But Dr. V had lied swindled and conned in her new identity. If she wanted her past to remain in the past she shouldn't have lied about her credentials. Eventually someone or another would call her out.
____________________________
Alma wrote:
I lost my post
#10 Jan 21 2014 at 12:05 PM Rating: Good
Honestly, the entire set of stuff is worth a good read, especially the articles. I have a couple of F2M friends and one M2F friend, and I've always known implicitly to keep their previous identities quiet, that it was not my place to divulge to mutual acquaintances, but having it spelled out in the essay by Cristina Kahrl kind of crystallized the "why" of that.

I also agree that people spend entirely too much money on golf clubs.
#11 Jan 21 2014 at 12:08 PM Rating: Decent
Lunatic
******
30,086 posts
But Dr. V had lied swindled and conned in her new identity. If she wanted her past to remain in the past she shouldn't have lied about her credentials. Eventually someone or another would call her out.

Sure. When they do it for self aggrandizement and money, it smells a little.
____________________________
Disclaimer:

To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#12 Jan 21 2014 at 11:11 PM Rating: Good
Official Shrubbery Waterer
*****
14,659 posts
Elinda wrote:
The journalist Hannan was incredibly thoughtless in his pursuit of the truth. He needn't have published anything about Dr. V's credentials to review the club. He could merely have left them out of claim that they were unverifiable.

Here's where I disagree. Part of the sales pitch for the club was that it was designed by a super-smart smarty-pants, which was a complete fabrication. Whether or not that really affected the club's performance is almost irrelevant; part of the value of a luxury item like a custom putter is the story used to sell it.

Saying that Dr. V's credentials were "unverifiable" is ignoring a large part of what made the putter she designed so unique.

Edited, Jan 21st 2014 11:12pm by Demea
____________________________
Jophiel wrote:
I managed to be both retarded and entertaining.

#13 Jan 22 2014 at 6:54 AM Rating: Default
Scholar
***
1,323 posts
...

Well, obviously he was a male since males are better at it.

I honestly am not sure how that is a story.
____________________________
Your soul was made of fists.

Jar the Sam
#14 Jan 22 2014 at 7:36 AM Rating: Good
Skelly Poker Since 2008
*****
16,781 posts
Demea wrote:

Saying that Dr. V's credentials were "unverifiable" is ignoring a large part of what made the putter she designed so unique.

Edited, Jan 21st 2014 11:12pm by Demea
But it's accurate and it gives enough information for someone to make a purchasing decision on.






____________________________
Alma wrote:
I lost my post
#15 Jan 22 2014 at 7:58 AM Rating: Good
*******
50,767 posts
It really isn't accurate. It's a vague euphemism that doesn't say anything at all.
____________________________
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#16 Jan 22 2014 at 8:11 AM Rating: Good
Skelly Poker Since 2008
*****
16,781 posts
lolgaxe wrote:
It really isn't accurate. It's a vague euphemism that doesn't say anything at all.
What it doesn't say is that Dr. V is a lying woman who used to be a man. I know how enamored people are over others sensationalized stories but it's irrelevant to the operation of the putter. Besides, the good doc specifically requested that this guys story be about the putter an not about her.

Regardless, the journalist didn't publish anything prior to her death, so I don't see where journalistic ethics were breached. Hannan did investigate the veracity of Dr. V's story. I'd think that necessary due diligence prior to reporting.
____________________________
Alma wrote:
I lost my post
#17 Jan 22 2014 at 8:17 AM Rating: Excellent
Will swallow your soul
******
29,360 posts
It would be enough to say, "There is no record of Essay Anne Vanderbilt attending MIT", or whatever claim you're disputing. You don't have to add, "because at that time she was a biological man named Fred Jones", or whatever.

You can dispute her claims without the big reveal.

But, again, it seems like this person was pretty unstable from the start. Understandable, in some ways, but not the fault of the reporter. What WAS his fault, was outing her. That should have been avoidable if he cared to try; from the statement by his editor, it never occurred to him to protect what was obviously a deeply hidden secret.
____________________________
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

#18 Jan 22 2014 at 11:55 AM Rating: Good
There was no record of Fred Jones attending MIT, either. Having MIT credentials was a straight up lie.

Otherwise, I agree. Outing her to an investor as a trans woman was not necessary. The editorial board could have cut out that entire section and we would have had a solid article about a sad woman who lived a fake life and killed herself when she felt people would discover her lack of credentials.
#19 Jan 22 2014 at 5:23 PM Rating: Decent
Encyclopedia
******
35,568 posts
Catwho wrote:
There was no record of Fred Jones attending MIT, either. Having MIT credentials was a straight up lie.

Otherwise, I agree. Outing her to an investor as a trans woman was not necessary. The editorial board could have cut out that entire section and we would have had a solid article about a sad woman who lived a fake life and killed herself when she felt people would discover her lack of credentials.


I'm sure that the point of including that in the article was to highlight the problems inherent in attempting to maintain the "secret" of a sex change. Let's assume for a moment that she did actually have an impressive resume and everything she said about her qualifications was true except that it all happened prior to her operation. She would have had the exact same problems trying to keep the fact that she used to be a man secret, right?

Of course, the flip side is that if we accept/respect someone's desire to keep that past hidden, then we no longer have any means to confirm someone's education, work history, etc. In this specific case, she was more or less trying to use her sex change as a means to conceal her past so that she could lie about it. That's problematic. Despite her claims that she wanted the focus on the putter and not on her, she was the one who kept making wild claims about her own past. Claims which could not possibly be confirmed without learning "the truth" about her sex change. That's on her, not the journalist IMO.


I guess the lesson here is that if you want to have a change like that and you want to keep it secret, you have to actually leave that entire life behind you and start over.
____________________________
King Nobby wrote:
More words please
#20 Jan 22 2014 at 5:52 PM Rating: Good
One of the editorials actually discusses that. That was the advice that psychologists used to give the early transpersons in the '80s. It's only in the last few decades that they've learned how damaging it is to start over from scratch. These days, transpersons are encouraged to seek support from friends and family as they transition.
#21 Jan 22 2014 at 7:12 PM Rating: Excellent
Will swallow your soul
******
29,360 posts
Quote:
I'm sure that the point of including that in the article was to highlight the problems inherent in attempting to maintain the "secret" of a sex change.


That would be an interesting point, except for the fact that no mention of her trans status was in the article in question. The reporter revealed it over the phone.

____________________________
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

#22 Jan 22 2014 at 8:13 PM Rating: Decent
Encyclopedia
******
35,568 posts
Samira wrote:
Quote:
I'm sure that the point of including that in the article was to highlight the problems inherent in attempting to maintain the "secret" of a sex change.


That would be an interesting point, except for the fact that no mention of her trans status was in the article in question. The reporter revealed it over the phone.


I was talking about the first link in the OP, which explains the whole series of events and clearly speaks about the fact that she was born a man and had a sex change. Which article were you thinking of?

Edited, Jan 22nd 2014 6:16pm by gbaji
____________________________
King Nobby wrote:
More words please
#23 Jan 23 2014 at 8:56 AM Rating: Good
*******
50,767 posts
Catwho wrote:
There was no record of Fred Jones attending MIT, either. Having MIT credentials was a straight up lie.
And the things that couldn't be verified might as well be lies as well.
____________________________
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#24 Jan 23 2014 at 9:00 AM Rating: Excellent
Will swallow your soul
******
29,360 posts
lolgaxe wrote:
Catwho wrote:
There was no record of Fred Jones attending MIT, either. Having MIT credentials was a straight up lie.
And the things that couldn't be verified might as well be lies as well.


Which is the point, really. Saying facts could not be verified is tantamount to saying "This person is clearly lying but I'd rather not be sued for libel."

____________________________
In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.

Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 322 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (322)